Consciousness, ego and vulnerability through the lens of the Zhineng Qigong Practice. These are some of the themes Nicolas Lovert-Dubert shares insights on. Consciousness, in Qigong, is both a receiver and sender of information, forming the foundation for transforming energy and physical reality. Ego, extends beyond showmanship to encompass self-centredness. He also shares how vulnerability, becomes a strength when openly acknowledged. The Zhineng Qigong practice was used to improve his life and overall happiness.

Dr. Pang’s philosophy that “no ego is the quickest way to enlightenment” serves as a central theme for Nicolas too. Qigong teachers he worked with, including Master Wei Qifeng, inspired him to react more consciously in various life situations. Being mindful of how he reacts in his everyday life. Because ultimately that’s what we can control, how we react to situations that are happening to us. 

Nicolas shares an experience with jealousy in his Qigong practice. He recalls feeling jealous of a fellow practitioner who he perceived as being more advanced and having a better state of consciousness than himself. Instead of hiding these feelings, Nicolas chose to openly admit his jealousy to the entire class. Not being phased by fear…

Fear forms part of the ego’s defensive mechanisms. Nicolas notes that ego is all about protection but ultimately limits you. Embracing vulnerability, instead of fighting it, unlocks personal power and authenticity. It’s using your frame of reference consciously that allows for broader perspectives and understanding.

Tune in to hear his story!

As a French translator, Nicolas has worked with many Qigong masters from China. In this episode, he shares some of his learnings, taking us on a fascinating journey from consciousness via the ego and the power of vulnerability. My name is Torsten Lueddecke, and this is the Wisdom Qigong Podcast. Thank you very much for inviting me, and thank you very much for watching us. To whoever is watching, I hope

this moment will be a very good moment to share. Zhineng Qigong, for me, is one of the ways to learn how to use consciousness in order to master the Qi, in order to have a happy, fulfilled life for me and for everyone who needs it. So when you talk about consciousness, what does that mean to you? Be honest, don’t just use words for the pleasure of talking. Consciousness

is the receiver as well as the one that sends. It’s also the state of being. And all this merges in the middle between what is received and what is sent. In the middle, the state of being is an emerging state. I think what is very interesting here is that. I think for most of us, when we hear the word consciousness, it is more about perceiving. Yeah, we, in

everyday life, we say, oh, I’m conscious of that, which means I am aware of that. But you say, equally important, consciousness has an ascending function. So maybe you would like to explore that a little bit. It’s the most fundamental aspect that we try to learn in the Zhineng Qigong, how we can produce information, which means thoughts, intention, that will be efficient in transforming energy and the physical reality.

And do you have any examples from your life or how you use consciousness? Just before this afternoon, I was back from practice, and after the practice, it was very intense and there was a cheer reaction. So, I was on my bicycle, and I was just thinking, relax, relax. And I was experiencing. I say relax, and it’s not just a thought. Relax is an action that takes place in

my energy and in my body that makes everything flow better, open, and relax. And I was thinking, this is the purpose of the Zhineng Qigong, to be able to do this. So, you’re using your mind, intention, to create in every moment, ideally of your life, what you would like for yourself. And if I remember, we started the conversation and you said that this is the path for you

to happiness. And one of the things that strikes me is that you seem to be a very happy young man. Is that fair to say? I do my best. It’s very important, especially in the Zhineng Qigong, because happiness is a way to… Perhaps in daily life, we cannot be free from our mind fixations, emotions, or reactivity. Perhaps it’s difficult to deal with this, and we may not be

free from the external attachments we have, but we can choose a way, every day, how we can make ourselves happy. We can dance, or we can sing, or we can laugh to bring back this state of happiness, which can be a good base for anyone, practitioner of the Zhineng Qigong or or non practitioner. Everyone would like to be happy and find a way to be more happy more

often. And this happiness that you’re referring to is obviously something that you can also see in, you know, in a lot of the masters that you’ve worked with. Because I know you are translating masters into French, not many people have the pleasure of working so closely with these masters. Most of us know one master we’ve gone to for a workshop or something like that. So this is a

very privileged position you’re taking there. It’s not just a contribution to the community, but it’s also great for you because you’re exposed to these amazing people. Now, what my audience would like to know, obviously, is what are the takeaways? So what are you learning? What have you learned from these masters? What stands out? Is there anything in particular? Many, many things. As you said, just to bond. From

what you said, working with teachers is very helpful to go deeper, to go deeper in the business way, which, in our society, we need business. But most of the time, we lose ourselves in business, in money, material things, being busy, working. So to be with people who have dedicated their lives to going deeper with their consciousness, their happiness, and their life, while also having a real job… and

how to react when things don’t go well, when you’re busy with things to do, and when you deal with people who are not easy for your mindset. Let’s trigger your mindset on how to do all this. I’ve learned a lot from teachers by looking at them, by talking with them. They inspired me, showed me, and advised me on how to be a more conscious worker. So, share that

with us. What exact teachings did you take for yourself? I mean, obviously, all of us would draw different conclusions and take different teachings on. But what were the important teachings for you, in a general way? Now, I enlarge the circle—not only business, but to be more happy and use happiness to improve my life, to live a life more conscious. Especially, I follow Teacher Wei’s teachings more closely. And

for him, it is very important to be conscious of consciousness, to be self-aware of consciousness. As it has been important for Dr. Pang in these last years, and still is, to understand deeper the practical level and adventures understanding level why the ego is not a good solution for dealing with daily life. Why it will lead to a dead end, why it will lead to more and more problems

and why it will never finish anything. So, what is your take on the ego? Because I think this is an important topic. I remember that I might be quoted incorrectly here, but I remember a story where Dr. Pang was asked what is the fastest way to enlightenment. And his answer was, no ego. And so, this is a very interesting idea that is worth to look into. And obviously,

you’ve been exposed to that, so maybe you could share a little bit about what that means to you and how you’re dealing with that, and how it shows up in your daily life. You, me, the people who listen, we know this by heart. It’s the core of our daily life; it’s almost the baseline of our daily life. It’s the way we eat, the way we answer to the

mail, the way we talk with our partner, the way I choose my food, the way I cook, the way I eat, and the way I decide what is important to me in my daily life activity, as well as my job, as well with my friends. All this, all the time, is highly influenced by the habit of the ego to self-center everything around what I want, my judgment about

everything, and then think this is the reality. My feeling and my judgment are the reality, and my point of view is how things should go. And all this is not true; it’s just a partial portion of reality. My name is Leila Cupido, and I’m the project manager of the Students Hub. Our team is constantly adding events, teachers, videos, and other resources to take your practice to the next

level, improving the quality of your life and the lives of the people around you. We do this work for you, so please use it. So, the self-centeredness for you is, an important aspect of the ego, right? Yeah. To always bring things to me. Me, what I want, me, what I know, me, what I feel. So you’re again using your awareness and your consciousness to know that your perspective

and your way of looking at things is just one of many. But for a lot of people, the ego means something more, right? The ego means that I have to be the best, that I have to show the world how great I am, etc., etc. So it’s interesting that you say this because a lot of people would just reduce the ego to that aspect now. People showing off

and wanting to be the greatest, that’s the ego, the Donald Trump kind of thing. But you’re taking it much further here when you say it’s about self-centeredness, it’s about relating everything that happens to you. And thinking that my perception of the moment is the reality. And so when we talk, then you should agree with me because we’re talking about the reality, and it’s a total mistake because it’s

just my perception, and the understanding, the feeling, the emotion, and all this is just personal. There is nothing that is shared. If a person has a totally different reference system, a totally different mindset, perhaps we will not even agree on a single thing about what the moment is about, or the moment when we are triggered in normal moments. We can agree on many things, of course, of course.

Normally, we can agree on many things. So what I hear is that this also leads to being opinionated, which is also a part of the ego. Because what does it mean? This word “opinionated” means I’ve got a strong opinion on something. So you see, I have a different worldview, but this is my worldview, so I’m opinionated. And I’ll tell you, no, this is the way things are. And

I think it’s great to mention that because when we’re looking for our growth path and we take Dr. Pang serious and the idea of the no ego serious, we need to look for indicators when our ego actually shows. Because we might not even be aware that this is how the ego shows up. So I think every time we’re opinionated and we try to convince someone of something, it’s

already a consequence of the ego showing up and wanting to make sure we impose our perspective, our worldview, on someone else, which is an ego thing. It’s the beginning of war. Yes, absolutely. It starts at this point, huh? I’m right, you’re wrong, and I’ll prove that you’re wrong. But in daily life, it’s so common and socially promoted, normally. The more ego is strong, the more we think people

are great. So it’s a good indicator if I find myself being opinionated to look back and ask, “Okay, where is this actually coming from? Am I coming from, you know, the ego here, or what is actually happening?” So, it’s a great way to train my consciousness and awareness of what’s going on, and then, you know, maybe take it to the next level and step out of that. Right?

Yeah. To step out of this and also to be able to embrace a larger perspective of what’s going on. To be able to embrace the fear that makes us want to self-protect and the suffering behind what will happen if I don’t know and if I am vulnerable. What will happen now in social relationships, in daily life moments, in business moments? Now, I don’t know. And I’m vulnerable. And

this vulnerability is just here. It’s not something to fight, you know, to break through this shell in order to see what is protected. The vulnerability is often our opinion, being opinionated, and having such a strong worldview is nothing but protection. Because as long as we stick to that worldview, we feel safe. It’s like, I’ve figured it out. I know what’s going on now. If I let go of

that, that’s exactly what you’re describing here. I’m making myself vulnerable, and I open up to the unknown, things I might not know yet. But that is, again, if we talk about life and connection. In my daily life, my perception, my feelings, my understanding mostly depend on the data I have in my mind. Out of this data, I don’t know what I will feel, perceive, or understand. Because everything

that I receive, I immediately interpret it according to the data I already have — about things, about me, about life, and about the patterns I’ve already created. I pass the information through the pipe, and it leads to a result. But the pipe, it’s a formation. It has been created by me and by many others, but I actively participate in their creation. And so, to be able to recognize

this level of creativity, because it’s also very creative to be able to do all this, seems to be a possibility for freedom. So, creativity is not about running all the information that you get through your pipes, filters, and frame of reference, because that’s not creative. It’s just an automatic thing that we’re doing. The creativity starts when you are aware of these filters and aware of the pipes, as

you call them. You’re aware of the frame of reference and then start to look at things without these filters and come up with new and different ideas. Is that fair to say? I think it’s both, because also creating the pipe was very creative when we were a child. When we learn how to become, how to behave like a grown-up or to play with the patterns of my parents,

my teachers, my friends, it has been a very creative, empowering, happy play. And then as I lost the innocence of childhood, I started to identify with the role, with the data, and all the play has been lost. And just the dry aspect of being a grown-up mostly remain. So the process initially was creative, I agree with that. But once it has been established, there’s no creativity anymore because

it’s just automatic, right? Yes, exactly. It’s going on and on and on and on. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Same day again and again and again. Yes. So you’ve worked with Teacher Wei a lot, I know that. Is there anything else that you’ve taken away from other teachers? Yes, of course. When I started with a French teacher, that used to practice more of a Chinese way, more intensive and hard.

Then I discovered Teacher Wei, and I felt it would be a very big ally to awake consciousness. So, I followed him in teacher training, in China. At that time there was a three-month teacher training with a big harmonious family, mostly with Teacher Liu and Ling. Many people know them, I think Liu Zendao, Ming, Teacher Xi Xiaofeng, Teacher Tao, Teacher Wei, and many other friends they had also. So

I stayed three months with them to learn the three level. And then the next year I came again for three months and the next year I came again for three months to learn, to learn, to go deeper. So I received a lot of information from all these teachers. They of course shared things that touched my beginner’s heart. Every time they talked about Huaxia Center and all the little

stories they had with Dr. Pang, all this is a treasure when you’re a beginner. Dr. Pang and I received many very practical things in daily life with them. About showing your vulnerability, showing your weak point very strongly in Teacher Tao’s mind. Show your weak point. You don’t know how to sing? Sing every day for everyone and don’t be ashamed of who you are. Show what you don’t know.

And yeah, it’s interesting that you call that a weak point because, you know, I would argue with it. I would say this is not a weak point if you know what you don’t know. And if you show that, that’s a very strong point. When you show it, it becomes a strong point. But if you hide it, it’s still a weak point. So you’re basically transforming a weak point

into a strong point by doing. You don’t want to be hurt at this part, you hide it, and everyone could touch it and ah, it will be very painful for your ego and for your self esteem. But okay, show your weak point and show. I learned a lot from this and I use it a lot when I work with others. I show that I don’t know, that my

ego is strong and that I’m lost. And like this, we can refer to a more humanistic way. We can refer to each other to a more humanistic ground. Yes. It’s much easier to relate to you if I see, well, you’ve got issues like me and you’ve got other stuff to deal with like everybody else. And I don’t have to pretend to be the big one. So it saves

a lot of energy also. Yes, I don’t have to pretend to know. And it’s also, you know, making life much easier because if the cards are on the table just as you described, you don’t have to pretend anything. And there’s nothing that can come up where people suddenly discover a weakness of yourself. It’s out already. Everybody’s there to know, right? You can improve because everyone knows now. Everyone

knows. I remember one time in my group there was a practitioner who was very, very good, much better than me, evolved, and had a much better state of consciousness than me. I was feeling so jealous, and so I told the whole class that I was feeling very jealous. And once it gets out, okay, now there is nothing else to hide. And now I can improve and I can

deal with this because I don’t have all the complicated work to protect myself and pretend. I can use this energy to accept who I am. Right. I think that’s a very powerful, powerful thing to do. A lot of us would probably say that, but more in a manipulative way. It’s like, “Oh, you’re so great, you know so much more than me,” hoping that the rest of the group

would say, “Oh no, you’re good as well.” But that is not the purpose here, right? The purpose is to be honest. The purpose is to be honest and say, look, yeah, that’s great. I mean, you are at a level that I’m on my way to, and that’s wonderful to have you in class here. And there’s no problem with that. Right. People can be much greater than me, and

it’s okay. Exactly. I think this is an important lesson here because we have a lot of teachers listening, you know, qigong teachers or therapists here listening to the podcast. And sometimes they feel the need to be better than their students because, you know, otherwise, why would the students come to them? Right? But this is, I think, a misconception because, as you know, as well as I know, we

can learn from anyone. Right. It doesn’t mean where this person comes from. It doesn’t mean what their education or background is. There’s a learning in every encounter with every single person, if we are open to that. Right now, to get that pressure off. Also, I was just telling you earlier, I’ve got a cough currently, so I’m coughing. Oh, God. Okay, okay. I should be healthy, right? Because I

know Zhineng Qigong now. Yeah, but I’ve got a cough, so here we go. But a therapist, you know, might, that does healing work with someone else, you know, you might have, I don’t know, a broken leg or whatever, or something going on, or a problem with the liver. I think that is important to just admit these things, but it doesn’t take from your power to do this work

with other people as well. So this honesty is very important and we need to take the pressure off the teachers and the therapists to be in a state of perfection in order to get their work done. It just makes them more relatable, makes us more relatable if we’ve got stuff going on in our lives and it creates a real connection. And it’s better than having someone on a

pedestal that we think, oh, my God, this person is so wonderful and interesting enough. This is also, you know, a great thing about, you know, Zhineng Qigong. Compared to other wise forms and philosophies, we don’t really have a guru in Zhineng Qigong. You know, we’ve got teachers. Yeah, right. But everybody can be a teacher to anyone. And this is not about… I mean, obviously, Dr. Pang plays a

special role because he’s come up with the whole thing. He’s the creator of it, so. So we value that. But he’s out there, not to be worshipped or anything. You know, he’s just out there and wants to, you know, make a contribution to humanity. And most of the masters, I must say, act exactly the same way. Right. So. So that is an important aspect of Zhineng Qigong. Now,

I’m getting a little off track here, but we started. I agree with this. Off track line. I agree with this. Where to go. I’m also very inspired by something that is not teached by teachers. It’s that when they are not at their best, when they have emotions, when they are lost, when they are reactive, this is also very comforting — that we are the same. Yes. There are

not some kind of special people who have something so special that I don’t have. They deal with the same daily life, with the same confusion and they also are lost. They also have emotion and they do their best just as me and we can do our best together. Yes. This feeds me very much. Also when I feel that I am not good enough, I remember the life of

Teacher Wei. And I remember before being Teacher Wei, he was also not good enough. Right. And they stayed that way. Nicolas. I remember a story about the Buddha. Now the Buddha was hit by a stone on his head and he said, ouch. And then people looked at him and said, but you are the Buddha. And he said, yes. And that’s the difference between a wooden Buddha and a

human Buddha. And. Right. So I think that kind of illustrates what you were saying here. Yeah. And that we are really, we are on the same baseline and we do our best. Yes. Okay. Well, thank you very much, Nicolas. That was very insightful and I’m glad you shared a little bit from your life and your experience here. Thank you very much, Nicolas. We trust you enjoyed this conversation

and we invite you to subscribe to our podcast so we can stay in touch and notify you of future episodes. We will end today’s episode with the Eight Verses Meditation performed by Zhineng Qigong teacher Katrien Hendrickx. Enjoy. To get your free eBook on the Eight Verses Meditation, please check the show notes below.